About the Brennan Program

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The Brennan Program is
a free voluntary Program,

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driven by the ideals of
justice consciousness,

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idealism and a sense of service.

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In accomplishing this award,
it developed students capacity

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for professional and personal
leadership and service.

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Since 2011, the Brennan Program
has accrued over 2,000 active members.

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My favourite part of it was probably
the connections that I made

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and the people that I met.

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My main goal in joining
the Brennan Program

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was to get more involved
in social justice.

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What I love about the Brendan Program

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is I really got to meet
so many different people

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and do a wide
range of tasks, you know,

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I was doing things from
volunteering at immigration centres

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to helping the elderly use IT.

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So, if you're a UTS law student,

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I would suggest that
you just give it a go.

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It's a fun, engaging
and diverse experience.

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Being surrounded by
people who are driven

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and who really care about
social justice issues,

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really inspired me as well
and it just reminded me that

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it's possible to create a better world.

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Anthea Vogl: Welcome, everyone who has joined us. We are just letting some people in from the waiting
room, but we will get going. It's wonderful to see so many of you here.
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Anthea Vogl: And great to see the entrance in the Brennan Justice Program, from, I'm sure, some new and,
some more familiar students as well.
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Anthea Vogl: My name is Associate Professor Anthea Vogel. I am the faculty co-director of the Brennan
Justice Program, and I'm joined by Alexis Dezodi, who is the… one of the student co-directors this year.
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Anthea Vogl: alongside Mel, who you'll probably meet sometime over the course of this year.
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Anthea Vogl: As you know, today's session is a more detailed, opportunity to learn about the Brennan Justice
Program, for us to present the program to you in a little bit more detail for those of you
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Anthea Vogl: who attended orientation and heard a little bit about the program. And it's also an opportunity
for you to ask questions about the program or, answer
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Anthea Vogl: any of your queries, both about how the program runs and how you can get involved, as well
as some of the opportunities you'll have access to throughout the course of the year.
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Anthea Vogl: Before we get into the session formally.
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Anthea Vogl: I would like to begin with our acknowledgement of country.
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Anthea Vogl: UT
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Anthea Vogl: Faculty of Law is situated on the lands of the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation. We pay our
respects to elders, both past and present, and we acknowledge them as the traditional owners of the land.
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Anthea Vogl: These have always been places of law, and we continue to exist and to teach you in these
plural legal worlds.
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Anthea Vogl: I'm sure everyone is very familiar with Zoom, so there isn't too much housekeeping to do, but I
would like to note that today's session is being recorded, but the recording will only be used for teaching and
learning purposes, and you'll only appear on the recording if you speak at the end of the session when we
have some time for Q&A.
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Anthea Vogl: Or turn your video on. We really do encourage you to turn your video on, particularly when
you're asking a question. It's lovely to see your faces.
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Anthea Vogl: in the discussion time or before that. And of course, for those of you who have already joined
the Brennan Justice Program, you earn 5 Reflections on Justice points, for attending this session.
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Anthea Vogl: If you've joined the session using something other than your UTS account, please just send the
Brennan Justice email a quick message after this, so we can make sure that we have your full name,
because your ROJ points will be automatically accrued via your attendance of this session.
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Anthea Vogl: Throughout the time that Alexis and I are presenting, feel free to put your questions in the
chat, and we'll come to them in the Q&A, so no need to wait to the very end to put the questions that you
have as they occur to you.
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Anthea Vogl: Alexis and I will both be presenting for the first part of the session, and after that, we'll move
to our discussion time.
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Anthea Vogl: So, as some of you may already know, we'll begin by talking a little bit about what the Brennan
Justice Program is. It's an entirely voluntary and co-curricular program for UTS Law students.
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Anthea Vogl: And the aim of the program is to really, instill a sense of justice and service in UTS law
students.
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Anthea Vogl: And to really meet, the desire of law students to engage in social justice issues.
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Anthea Vogl: I know many students, including myself when I began my law degree, began to study law
because of an interest in the relationship between justice and the law.
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Anthea Vogl: The Brenton Justice Program is a program that allows you to kind of pursue that interest and
get involved in both legal and non-legal organisations and activities and events that have to do with justice
and equality and fairness right from the beginning of your degree.
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Anthea Vogl: The program is named after Sir Gerard Brennan. Some of you may know and will have read the
judgments of Sir Gerard Brennan, who was a former Chief Justice of the High Court of Australia. One of his
most well-known judgments was, of course, the Marboot Judgment, which many of you would have read in
your Foundations of Law subject.
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Anthea Vogl: And would have continued to reflect upon and learn about as you continue throughout your
law degree in other, compulsory and non-compulsory subjects.
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Anthea Vogl: So Jared Brenham was also the UTS Chancellor, so he had a very close relationship with UTS
and UTS Law.
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Anthea Vogl: And the program is named after him because it attempts to emulate and reflect the life of
service and commitment to social justice that Sir Gerard exemplified throughout both his career as a jurist,
but also beyond that in his service to the legal community and broader community.
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Anthea Vogl: There really is no other program, like the Brennan Justice Program in other law schools in
Australia. It…
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Anthea Vogl: is a really flexible and dynamic program, and responsive to, kind of, everyday social justice
issues, and we would like to think it's really accessible to UTS Law students, so you can get involved in the
program and sign up, and do as much or as little of the program as you would like.
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Anthea Vogl: And UTS law students who complete the program, so those of you who might wish to take out
the award and commit to,
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Anthea Vogl: meeting all of the points requirements that we'll talk about throughout this session, take out
the Brennan Justice and Leadership Award.
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Anthea Vogl: And if you take out that award, it is recognised when you graduate.
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Anthea Vogl: And I know from, kind of, experience and having acted as a referee for many Brennan Justice
students and my own students, that the program is actually really well recognised within the legal profession
now, and among and across employers.
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Anthea Vogl: So it really does give you, an ability to communicate some of your interests and your
experience when you are seeking employment. But of course, it's not just about your future employment, it's
about, the service that you…
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Anthea Vogl: Provide, and the learning, that you are able to access as part of the program once you join.
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Anthea Vogl: These aren't the only things that you will get from the Brennan Justice Program as a student
who joins the program.
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Anthea Vogl: So, you can join the program in your very first year. That's a question we often get, and in
doing so, you will be joining over a thousand of your other UTS Law students and peers who are part of the
program and who actively engage in it.
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Anthea Vogl: Once you join the program, what you get access to immediately is our series of,
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Anthea Vogl: faculty-hosted talks and events. There's two to three of those every session, and they are both
in person and online. And
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Anthea Vogl: They are very responsive to student interests, current issues, and also give you access to
different people in the profession and beyond it who are working in the social justice space.
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Anthea Vogl: As I said, while we very much hope you do complete all the requirements of the program, and
kind of make it a big part of your law degree once you join UTS,
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Anthea Vogl: You don't have to complete all of the aspects of the program to be part of the Brennan Justice
community. So, you can enrol in the program now if you haven't already.
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Anthea Vogl: And start to participate and get access to all of the Brennan Justice activities and opportunities,
including volunteer opportunities and, information about different events and activities that are going on
around the law school and within the law school.
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Anthea Vogl: I think one of the best things about the program is its flexibility. We really appreciate how busy
law students are. We know, as your lecturers, how demanding we are, and how much work you have to do
in your subjects.
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Anthea Vogl: But beyond that, the pressures of, working alongside studying, and of course, family and social
lives, which are also very important.
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Anthea Vogl: And so the ability to kind of engage on your own terms and be part of the community, I think,
is something that is really positive.
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Anthea Vogl: If you complete the program, you get a letter of reference from the dean, you're able to get
recognition of the award, particularly on LinkedIn, when you start to look for employment.
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Anthea Vogl: And you also get recognition of the award on your testimer, so your final, certificate when you
graduate.
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Anthea Vogl: And you are invited to the Law Awards night, once you've completed all parts of the program,
and you are officially given the award as part of the Brennan Justice Cohort, for your year.
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Anthea Vogl: So, they're the really, kind of, positive things that you get out of the award at the same time
as, really participating in, and in… and…
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Anthea Vogl: providing social justice and service to the different organisations that you will engage in
through, enrolling in the Brennan Justice Program.
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Anthea Vogl: So…
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Anthea Vogl: I'm now going to hopefully play a short video which gives you a little bit of a sense of the
Brennan Justice Program from a student who has completed the program and, is sharing with us what he
has gotten out of the program.
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Anthea Vogl: So, let me… See how this goes.
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Audio shared by Anthea Vogl: The Brennan Program is a free, voluntary program driven by the ideals of
justice consciousness, idealism, and a sense of service. In accomplishing this award, it develops students'
capacity for professional and personal leadership and service.
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Audio shared by Anthea Vogl: Since 2011, the Brennan Program has accrued over 2,000 active members. My
favourite part of it was probably the connections that I made, and the people that I met.
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Audio shared by Anthea Vogl: My main goal in joining the Brennan Program was to get more involved in
social justice. What I love about the Brennan Program is I really got to meet so many different people and
do a wide range of tasks. You know, I was doing things from volunteering at an immigration center, to
helping the elderly use IT. So if you're a UTS law student, I would suggest that you just give it a go.
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Audio shared by Anthea Vogl: It's a fun, engaging, and diverse experience. Being surrounded by people who
are driven and who really care about social justice issues really inspired me as well, and it just reminded me
that it's possible to create a better world.
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Audio shared by Anthea Vogl: The Brennan Program…
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Anthea Vogl: So, that gives you a little insight into the Brennan Justice Program. This is the Brennan Justice
team, so you'll be able to see Alexis and I on the Zoom video now, but there's a wonderful team of law…
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Anthea Vogl: Faculty, staff, who are here to support the program, and support you in engaging in its
opportunities.
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Anthea Vogl: Crystal Mekel is currently on leave, but will be returning to us later in the year. Alongside
Crystal, we have Sivan Walker, Bette Keane, and, Nalusha Cure.
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Anthea Vogl: who's not represented here on the slide, who is another member of the team, and of course,
and probably most importantly for you guys, your student co-directors, who are always available to support
you and answer questions, so Alexis, but also Melanie Davis, who you'll meet throughout the course of the
year.
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Anthea Vogl: I am now going to hand over to Alexis, who will talk to you a little bit more about how the
program operates.
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Alexis De Zotti: Thank you, Anthea. So, as she mentioned, I'm one of the Brendan Student Co-Directors, and
it's really great to see so many of you joining us today.
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Alexis De Zotti: So now, Anthea gave you a sense of what the Brennan program is, and what you can get
out of it. I'm just gonna walk you through how it actually works in practice, and then how you can start
getting involved from this session. So, before we get into the structure, I just wanted to briefly highlight
where you'll be accessing everything.
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Alexis De Zotti: Because I know how busy the semester gets, so it'll become really important once all those
assignments and extra stuff starts creeping up at uni.
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Alexis De Zotti: So, a lot of this might actually already feel familiar to you. For example, Career Hub is what
you all would have used to register for today's session, and it's the same platform that you'll use to register
for all Brennan events and track your progress.
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Alexis De Zotti: You'll also receive regular emails from the Brennan team with updates and different
opportunities.
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Alexis De Zotti: So it's definitely worth keeping an eye on those. In addition, platforms like the Brennan
Collective Facebook group and Canvas Announcements, I find are really useful for finding opportunities as
they arise and signing up through that.
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Alexis De Zotti: So you don't need to remember things… remember all of these now, but just keep in mind
these are the main places that you'll be checking throughout the program, so maybe make note of them, or
come back and refer to these slides.
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Alexis De Zotti: So, moving on, at its core, the Brennan program is structured around two key components.
So, the first being reflections on justice, or as we like to call it, ROJ, and leadership through service, or LTS.
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Alexis De Zotti: So, ROJ focuses on engaging with ideas of justice, whether that's through different lectures,
seminars, and discussions, and they really explore how justice operates in different contexts.
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Alexis De Zotti: And then LTS, on the other hand, is more the practical component. So, this is what, where
you volunteer and contribute to the community, and you can also develop your initiative and leadership
skills.
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Alexis De Zotti: So to complete the program, you'll work towards 100 ROJ points, as well as a set of LTS
hours, and this will be dependent on your specific degree. But importantly, like Anthea mentioned before,
there is very much flexibility in how you achieve this.
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Alexis De Zotti: So you can really choose opportunities that align with your interests and your capacity.
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Alexis De Zotti: Right, so focusing now more specifically on leadership through service, like I said, this is the
volunteering component of the program.
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Alexis De Zotti: And, a helpful way to approach it is to just aim for 30 hours
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Alexis De Zotti: Per each year of your degree, and although there is now greater flexibility, following the
recent program update, which is good, and means it's basically designed to fit alongside your academic and
work commitments.
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Alexis De Zotti: And I think our main advice to you all is to start early, so even just a small amount each
semester makes the overall requirement much more manageable, and for us doing, you know, a 4- or a 5-
year degree, like, it really, can add up if you're just doing a bit each semester.
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Alexis De Zotti: Alright, and then, looking at CareerHub, when it comes to logging your progress, CareerHub
is your central platform.
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Alexis De Zotti: So there is a short video, included.
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Alexis De Zotti: I think it's the next two signs. But,
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Alexis De Zotti: There's a short video included in your welcome that walks you through how to claim both
RHJ and LTS hours, so it's definitely worth taking the time to watch that. And I'm gonna hand back over to
Anthea now, who's gonna go a bit more into detail about the LTS hours.
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Anthea Vogl: Thanks so much, Alexis. I think that video might be something that you can access via Careers
Hub, so we'll share with our attendees, after the event. But…
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Anthea Vogl: with Alexis having given a really lovely outline of the aspects of the program and leadership
through service, often students will ask, how do I get access to leadership through service opportunities, and
what counts as leadership through service?
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Anthea Vogl: I really echo what Alexa said. It's really great to start thinking about, small opportunities or,
ways you might begin to do a little bit of volunteering early on in your degree.
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Anthea Vogl: And those things, you can accumulate all kinds of different leadership through service
opportunities throughout your degree, so it needn't be with one organization. When thinking about where
you can do your leadership through service hours.
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Anthea Vogl: A really important point is it doesn't have to be law-related, so there aren't only law
organisations or organisations to do with social justice and the law.
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Anthea Vogl: The main criteria that you have to focus on is that it's voluntary, so you don't do your hours for
other academic credit or for money.
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Anthea Vogl: You have to do your hours for a not-for-profit organization. So, an organization, that is not-forprofit,
sometimes students have questions about whether or not an organization fits that criteria. You can
always send us an email and we can help you understand if the organization is for-profit or not-for-profit.
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Anthea Vogl: Your leadership through service hours need to be spread across more than one year. So, as
Alexa said, that's another good reason to start early, because one thing that you can't do is simply do all of
your hours in the final year of your degree.
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Anthea Vogl: And as I said, it can be single or multiple volunteer placements, and because, it's an achievable
number of hours to take out the award, but it's not a small amount of hours, so we do find that students,
tend to seek out experiences in different aspects of,
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Anthea Vogl: their social justice interests, so you might be interested in climate change action, you might be
interested in refugee issues, you might be interested in Indigenous justice, so you can volunteer across
those different areas throughout the course of your degree.
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Anthea Vogl: Important to note that credit for your hours will only accrue from when you're first enrolled in
your law degree, so even if you have already got an excellent volunteer interest and you are engaging in
those volunteer hours before the first year of your degree, you can only accrue hours from when you began
your degree.
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Anthea Vogl: That having been said, if you, say, did some volunteer hours and didn't, register or log them
with us straight away during your degree, that's completely fine. So you can then say, oh, actually, I forgot I
was working for a homelessness shelter in the first year of my degree, can I accrue LTS hours for that? And,
we can assist you to log those hours, and for them to accrue towards your Brenham Justice Award.
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Anthea Vogl: This next slide gives you, some examples, and I've already mentioned some of these, of the
areas in which our students start to volunteer. So some of those things have included providing services for
homeless people, doing advocacy for different, marginalised groups, such as Indigenous organization, or
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Anthea Vogl: Organisations or refugees and asylum seekers.
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Anthea Vogl: Other students have interned or acted as a research assistant at a faculty research center,
particularly when they're doing social justice engagement work, so not just straightforward academic
research, but doing work to assist community members.
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Anthea Vogl: You can volunteer with an agency that has a service function, so different, kind of, kinds of
services provided to different groups.
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Anthea Vogl: And there is the opportunity to undertake leadership through services hours via the LSS, and
other student societies, again, depending on the student society, and if it has that important, aspect of, kind
of, service to the community.
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Anthea Vogl: It…
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Anthea Vogl: It's sometimes easier than other times to find a leadership through service opportunity, and it
does require you to take a little bit of initiative or think about the things that you might be interested in.
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Anthea Vogl: We really encourage you to follow your own interests and associations, so you can find
opportunities in your local community. There might be a kind of local group, supporting the elderly close to
where you live, or there might be an initiative around
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Anthea Vogl: kind of, uplift of the… the amenity and infrastructure in your council area, and they're seeking
volunteers.
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Anthea Vogl: Those kind of opportunities are really great, and they can, kind of meet you where you are. But
we also, often enough, through the law faculty's relationships with a whole range of social justice
organisations.
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Anthea Vogl: We'll post leadership through service opportunities, via Canvas and in our Brennan Justice
Facebook page.
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Anthea Vogl: That's a really great thing to have access to if you join the program, because it means that you
can kind of go, oh, wait a minute, I am really interested in
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Anthea Vogl: access to justice, and access to justice organisations, and you might see a community legal
center be seeking someone to volunteer for their annual conference, and that gives you a really small and
discrete opportunity that might fit alongside your study, and you might jump on that opportunity and find
that it absolutely is in your interests, and it's something you might want to pursue later in your degree or in
your career.
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Anthea Vogl: As Alexis mentioned, these announcements come up through the Canvas page, via email, and
via the Brennan Collective Facebook group.
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Anthea Vogl: Listed here on the slide are some other places where you can go and have a look for volunteer
opportunities that you might
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Anthea Vogl: actually have encountered, before joining the Brennan Justice Program, if you've been
volunteering otherwise. So, there's the Go Volunteer website, the Pro Bono Australia website, and then the
Good Company website.
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Anthea Vogl: And you can also just kind of use your own initiative and Google different volunteer
opportunities with organisations that are of interest to you. And yeah, we encourage you to reach out if
there's been a place that you've always wanted to work.
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Anthea Vogl: This is a really lovely opportunity to just send them an email and say, I'm part of a program
that supports me to do some volunteering in a field of interest to me, is there any volunteering available?
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Anthea Vogl: So…
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Anthea Vogl: as I mentioned, as the team behind the Brendan Justice Program, we do provide you with,
some volunteer opportunities through the faculty that you can get involved with.
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Anthea Vogl: And one of those excellent volunteer opportunities that runs, every year is the Wattenkani
Nyota UTS Law Tech Challenge for Social Justice that some of you might have heard about.
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Anthea Vogl: So, this, particular opportunity started in 2016, and it involves the Brennan, program, now in
partnership with the excellent law firm Wattenkani, a leading international law firm, and the software
company Neoda Logic.
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Anthea Vogl: Under this challenge, students team up with non-government organisations
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Anthea Vogl: to help them develop real apps to assist with their clients or services. So it's a real-life exercise,
and you will learn the skills and work with a client, i.e. a particular not-for-profit organization, in order to
develop an app, which they then integrate into the work that they're doing.
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Anthea Vogl: Students involved in this challenge have developed, excellent apps to solve real-life problems
that organisations might have in terms of something their client needs or something their staff needs for
over 20 different organizations.
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Anthea Vogl: So, we usually call for student participants, at some time in the year, so that will also come out
through the Brennan Justice, communication lines. And once you apply and perhaps are chosen, you will be
given a client and work with that client.
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Anthea Vogl: And then there's a grand final in August of this year, and all of the apps are presented in a
wonderful kind of gala evening, with your team presenting, kind of, the problem that your app solves, and
why your app is the best way to solve that problem.
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Anthea Vogl: And it is, then judged, and there's a winner of the, the Tech Justice, the social justice challenge
at the end of that night.
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Anthea Vogl: But also, there's no way to lose in terms of participating because of the wonderful experience
you'll get in developing those apps for your clients. So keep an eye out for the 2026 challenge and the
opportunity to get involved.
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Anthea Vogl: I think I'm handing back over to Alexis now to talk to you a little bit more about, other practical
aspects of the program.
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Alexis De Zotti: So, as we mentioned before, we're gonna send you an email on a short video of navigating
CareerHub, and I can say it is a little bit confusing at the start, but once you have used the system a couple
times, it does become quite straightforward, so keep an open mind with that.
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Alexis De Zotti: So in terms of accruing ROJ points, just moving on to the next slide…
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Alexis De Zotti: There are several different opportunities, dependent on how you like to engage with it. So,
the most straightforward way is by attending Brennan events, so just like you all have today, you register
through CareerHub, attend the session, and then your points are recorded automatically through CareerHub.
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Alexis De Zotti: Another option is you can also attend external events, which typically involves uploading
proof of attendance or completing a short reflection.
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Alexis De Zotti: And then, another great opportunity is discussion groups. So these are more in-depth, and
they do provide a great opportunity to engage more critically with issues surrounding justice.
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Alexis De Zotti: And then, moving on to the next slide, there are a few more flexible and more, like, selfdirected
ways to earn ROJ points, like LTS hours. So, ad hoc activities allow you to claim reflections on
opportunities.
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Alexis De Zotti: That may not fall within the standard categories, and you can also complete a substantial
reflective piece on a topic of interest, which can be submitted in a format of your choice.
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Alexis De Zotti: And then additionally, the Brennan Book Program is a popular option for students,
particularly if you enjoy engaging more deeply with text and reflecting on broader themes of justice. So
overall, there is definitely a wide range of options to suit your different interests and your different time
commitments.
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Alexis De Zotti: Which is really good.
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Alexis De Zotti: Moving on to the next slide, if you're looking to get started, there are already a number of
opportunities available this session, so I know that there's an upcoming Justice Talk taking place very soon.
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Alexis De Zotti: And also, applications for discussion groups are already open, so definitely sign up, through
the form, through all of our communication there on Facebook, Instagram, etc.
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Alexis De Zotti: But yeah, the best way to find these opportunities is through Career Hub, Canvas, or the
Brendan Collective Facebook group.
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Alexis De Zotti: And a useful tip from us is to bookmark CareerHub very early on, so go do it now, as it just
makes it so much easier to keep track of your progress, and then you're able to register events, and you
don't miss out, because a lot of it is booked and busy. And then, to the next slide,
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Alexis De Zotti: Another thing we would like to advise you on is the Canvas calendar.
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Alexis De Zotti: which can be used as a really valuable tool, and actually not a lot of people know about it,
but it provides a centralized view of events happening across the Faculty of Law, making it really easy to
stay informed, and again, not missing out on these events.
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Alexis De Zotti: And while you're already on your Canvas, completing, you know, your assignments or
different coursework, you can just quickly check what's coming up, and, you know, it's a simple habit, but it
makes staying engaged with the program so much more manageable.
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Alexis De Zotti: And to give you an idea of what leadership through service can look like in practice, there
are a wide range of opportunities available. So these… these can include activities such as donating blood,
volunteering with organisations like OzHarvest.
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Alexis De Zotti: And new… more… more opportunities will be shared throughout the year, so it's just really
important to keep an eye out on the different platforms we've mentioned earlier, and just to reiterate,
starting early allows you to explore different options and find something that genuinely interests you, so get
started now, and…
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Alexis De Zotti: Yeah, so I want to thank everyone for listening, and I think I'll hand over to Anthea to open
up the floor to any questions that you might have.
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Anthea Vogl: Great, thank you so much, Alexis. I might stop the share so we can see the screen.
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Anthea Vogl: and see everyone who's joined. You're very welcome to pop your questions in the chat. If you
have particular questions about any aspect of the program, or how you might get involved, or otherwise,
you're very welcome to
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah, just pop your hand up and, turn your microphone off, and ask any questions that you
might have.
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Anthea Vogl: Okay.
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Anthea Vogl: So, one of the questions in the chat, it's, are we able to put our LTS hours towards
volunteering for UTS clubs? That's a great question, and a question we get asked pretty often. The short
answer is it depends on the club. So, we're always looking for the connection with, kind of, service, and
justice consciousness and justice.
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Anthea Vogl: But generally, if the club is engaging in some kind of community service or community
engagement, then the volunteer hours or the work that you might be doing through that particular club are
absolutely eligible for LTS hours.
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Anthea Vogl: Another question that we have, would volunteer…
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Anthea Vogl: just having a look here. Would volunteer work on committees such as the PNC committee
qualify? Yeah, again,
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Anthea Vogl: Potentially, yes. One of the interesting things is the work that is done for public schools as
versus private schools. Private schools are not not-for-profit organisations, and so
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Anthea Vogl: unless they're partnering with another, say, not-for-profit, so private schools will often work
with different NGOs or homelessness organisations where students provide services and,
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Anthea Vogl: kind of ex-students might get involved in those services, so then that can be an LTS, that can
accrue LTS hours.
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Anthea Vogl: particularly work with public schools, or doing work for public schools, absolutely can, qualify
for LTS hours, including, PMC, kind of, committees and opportunities.
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Anthea Vogl: Our advice is always, if you're unsure for any reason, and particularly if it's work you're already
engaging in, just send the Brennan Justice team an email. We're really, really responsive, and we'll help kind
of look at the particular opportunity that you are engaging in, and let you know if it's eligible for LTS hours.
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Anthea Vogl: Are there other questions coming through, Alexis, as I'm chatting? Let's have a look.
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Anthea Vogl: Applications… oh, great question about applications for the LawTech Challenge. They will open,
applications for the LawTech Challenge,
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Anthea Vogl: We'll open at the end of September of this year, so the… we'll go into, kind of, the end of the
year, and the awards will be presented in the following year. So Nelouch has already kindly answered that
for us.
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Anthea Vogl: Rachel, we might, go to your question, since you've got your hand up, and then come back to
the questions in the chat.
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Rachael Ford: Thanks. I was going to type it, then it got complicated.
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Anthea Vogl: No problem.
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Rachael Ford: Oh, it's good.
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Anthea Vogl: to hear a voice, yep.
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Rachael Ford: So, two parts. First of all, I'm in my final year, but I haven't actually entered anything in in the
last three years, because I've been too busy with work and doing stuff for not-for-profits and uni, so can I
go back and enter that in retrospectively?
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Anthea Vogl: It's a great question. Yes, the short answer is yes. The slightly longer answer is…
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Anthea Vogl: what you need for your LTS hours is always sign off from the people that you were completing
those hours with. You can also get that retrospectively, you might already have it. If you haven't, great, just
pop it in. And if you don't, then making sure that you have someone who is able to kind of verify that you
were doing those LTS hours, it's a pretty… it's not a terribly bureaucratic process, but it's part of the process,
but yeah, retrospectively is fine.
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Rachael Ford: So the other thing with that is, so for my day job, I do work with a not-for-profit, so I
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Rachael Ford: I do work with lots of different entities.
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Anthea Vogl: Yep.
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Rachael Ford: However, I also do a lot of stuff for them on the weekend and in between that I don't get paid
for, so can I… even though I'm doing it for my day job, the stuff that I don't get paid for with that not-forprofit,
my own hours on the weekend, can I claim those?
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah, as long as it's not… as it's… if it's not part of work that you are being paid for, so if
you're volunteering as part of your job, and people do that, you know, in other… when they don't work for
not-for-profits, then yeah, that's eligible.
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Rachael Ford: I work at the time, but I do a lot of it in my own time and don't get paid, so that's the bit
that…
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Anthea Vogl: So, if it's not on… on… on the clock for work, and you're…
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Rachael Ford: volunteering. There's a lot that's 7 o'clock. Yep, absolutely.
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Anthea Vogl: Yep. Yep.
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Rachael Ford: Thank you very much.
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Anthea Vogl: liminal.
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Anthea Vogl: Alexis, did you want to have a look and,
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Anthea Vogl: pick some of the, questions from the chat, I can have a look as well.
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Alexis De Zotti: Yes.
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Anthea Vogl: Yet.
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Alexis De Zotti: So, I'll respond to Mark, I was just typing up.
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Alexis De Zotti: But, do we have to complete ROJ over a period of 18 months? No, you definitely don't. You
have the duration of your degree, which is one thing that we pride the program on very much, being flexible.
So yeah, don't have to worry about getting it done within 18 months. You definitely have the duration of
degree.
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Alexis De Zotti: Okay, and then Vanessa's asked, she's recently changed from a double degree, which was 5
years, to a single degree of 4 years.
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Alexis De Zotti: So, resulting in a total of 4.5 years. So she's wondering how many LTS hours she needs.
Does she need 120, or does she need 150, or somewhere in between to reflect the 4.5 hours?
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah.
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Anthea Vogl: That's a great question, Vanessa. Can I suggest, because it's a bit of a unique situation, and it
would be good to get, kind of, the documentation of when you switched over, if you email the Brennan
Justice email, then we can have a look at the… when you were doing a double degree, when you were doing
your single degree, and then work with you to, calculate the LTS hours required.
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Alexis De Zotti: Yes, okay. We've got another question from Royston, apologies if I'm saying anyone's name
wrong, but…
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Alexis De Zotti: How often will Brennan events for RHA points be held? They know that there's one on the
1st of April, but will there be only one for April, and then one in the next month? And just what's the
structure of that?
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Alexis De Zotti: Yep,
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Anthea Vogl: That's a great question. We've already had one… so, we tend to have between two or three
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Anthea Vogl: law faculty run, Brennan Justice events a session. So they're not necessarily run monthly, but
they'll always be at least two events a session. And they… the next one for… so that's the one that we have
planned for the next session, it's the one coming up, next week.
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Anthea Vogl: Generally, if you aren't able to attend one of the faculty-based sessions in person or online, one
important thing to note is that they're always recorded, and we actually now have a podcast of Brennan
Justice Talks on Spotify, so you can listen to the event after the fact if you missed it. And you can then
reflect… you can use your ROJ points to reflect on the
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Anthea Vogl: event, and write a short reflection, and then accrue your points that way, rather than attending
the event in person.
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Anthea Vogl: Or online, at the same time.
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Anthea Vogl: The other thing to think about is that all kinds of social justice talks and events, are eligible for,
your ROJ reflections. So, if there's an event that the faculty isn't running, or perhaps is run in a different part
of the faculty, sorry, a different part of the university, you can attend that event, and then register with us
that you've attended it, and also get reflections.
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Anthea Vogl: on justice points. So even though we've run an excellent program of talks every session, it's
great to keep your ear to the ground for other things that might be of interest to you, because it's not just
UTS Law events that are eligible.
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Alexis De Zotti: I can read out the next question. So we've got it from Mark, and he's asking if we can apply
LTS hours already completed to other programs, such as the Build and Soul program. I'm going to say yes,
but let you take it away.
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah, that's also something, Mark, that's worth, sending an email to us about the particular
programs and your engagement in them. Sometimes for UTS-based programs where you might be accruing
credit, in another internship-like opportunity or towards another award.
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Anthea Vogl: They aren't necessarily eligible for LTS hours, but with other programs they are. So, send us an
email about your particular participation, and we often know those programs really well, and have already
established what LTS hours can and can't be accrued, based on what you might be already getting out of the
program, in the context of another award.
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Alexis De Zotti: Yes, okay, and then we've got Brianna. She's asked two questions, we'll start off with the
first one. She's asking, how many volunteer hours do we have to do each year? I recall you saying we can
do them all in the last year, but does it have to be over every single year of your degree?
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Alexis De Zotti: I mean, I'm happy to answer this one.
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Anthea Vogl: Oh, another, like, associate.
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Alexis De Zotti: You don't have to have a set amount of hours each year, so we just advise
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Alexis De Zotti: splitting it up 30 hours each year, because that's an even split. However, I don't know, in
your first year, if you find you have more time, or your second year, you can smash them all out then if you
want. Like, yeah, like, you really can do it whenever you want,
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Alexis De Zotti: But yeah, hopefully that answers your question, and then your second… oh yeah, if you want
to add on.
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah, go ahead. I would add one thing to that, is that we… you can't accrue… the only… so it
might sound a little bit confusing when we say you can't accrue them all in 12 months. The only limit, as
Alexis kind of indicated.
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Anthea Vogl: earlier, is that you can't do them all in one year. So.
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Anthea Vogl: part of the reason for that is that we want you to try and spread them out over your law
degree, so there's not so much pressure on you to complete the, your LTS hours in one year. But as Elitza
said, that doesn't mean you have to complete the same amount of hours every year. It's just that… that one
rule that you can't just kind of,
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Anthea Vogl: you know, decide to smash out 100 hours in a year, and part of that is our concern for your
wellbeing. We don't want to put you in a position where you need to kind of be, doing so many volunteer
hours alongside your degree.
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Alexis De Zotti: Yep.
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Alexis De Zotti: And then she's also asked what the process of getting sign-off from the organizations you
volunteer with entail, and she's wondering if there's a specific form, that you have to get them to complete,
or is it just a signature?
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah, Alexis probably knows the answer to that one too, but yeah, generally, it's a really
straightforward form that we provide you with.
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Anthea Vogl: And it's just a signature, from the person who is supervising your work, and overseeing your
volunteering, to really simply say and verify the number of hours that you worked with, that organization for,
that you then log via Career Hub.
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Alexis De Zotti: We've got Cybella asking where the discussion group applications are. So, those ones were
sent, there's a post on, the UTS Law Student Society's Instagram, on the Brennan Facebook. There is also a
link, I do believe there was…
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Alexis De Zotti: Also, an email that was circulated, or we may send out one also closer to the closing date in
a couple days. But if you go back through the posts, you'll be able to find them, hopefully, and they're linked
in the description.
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Anthea Vogl: Correct. I can see another question.
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Anthea Vogl: Can we claim hours from the year we were enrolled, if the volunteering was performed before
we enrolled? So…
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Anthea Vogl: No, no, so the short answer is your LTS hours, even if you might have been involved, enrolled
at UTS in another degree,
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Anthea Vogl: the point at which you can start to accrue your LTS hours is from the beginning of your law
degree. So if you transferred into law, for example, halfway through the year, and you're continuing that
volunteer opportunity, that's when you can start to claim your LTS hours.
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Anthea Vogl: Samantha has asked, can we claim LTS hours for events that are run by the New South Wales
Law Society? Yes, you absolutely can, and that's a really good example of an organization that holds really
great public events and discussions about law and justice topics.
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Anthea Vogl: And you… you are able to attend… you are able to kind of claim for attending those, Law
Society events, for sure.
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Anthea Vogl: Next question, on the Career Hub FAQ, it says,
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Anthea Vogl: what does it say here? It's, 20 hours for a five-year degree, but in this session, you just said it's
5 hours. I was wondering which is the correct amount. Yes, so we had a recent change, in the LTS hours,
really.
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Anthea Vogl: that change for students who are new, you might not have received the communication about
that from one year to the next, but
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Anthea Vogl: The, that reform involved a reduction of the total number of LTS hours that any student is
required to complete to take out the Brennan Justice Award, and so it was a proportionate kind of reduction
of hours each year, so, it…
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Anthea Vogl: Was calculated differently depending, again, on if you're in a 3-year degree, a 4-year degree,
or a 5-year degree.
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Anthea Vogl: Everyone's hours were reduced, and that was in response to discussions and getting feedback
and surveying students about how the program was operating, and really in recognition of the cost of living
pressures that students are facing, pressures to do paid work.
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Anthea Vogl: Alongside of their degree, and maybe more paid work than they've done in the past, and
pressures around rent and housing costs. So we reduced the number of total LTS hours, so the correct
number
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Anthea Vogl: Scarlett is the hours that we presented today, and we did that to encourage more students to
get involved, and also to make, getting the Brennan Justice Award a bit more of a feasible opportunity for
those of you, who are part of the UTS Law faculty.
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Anthea Vogl: Next question… oh, thanks. That was already, answered, kind of, but I was just giving a little
bit of background to why that change took place.
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Anthea Vogl: Can we write reflections on justice based on our own experiences with the courts or police?
That's a really interesting question, and I would absolutely say, yeah, that's great. If you've had a particular
encounter,
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Anthea Vogl: with a social justice issue, or even, you know, there's no barrier to you writing reflections on
justice in relation to the LTS hours you've served, or your, as Michael has asked, in relation to your own
interactions with the justice system.
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Anthea Vogl: If you are doing that, and it's not something that, is kind of in the public domain, just explain,
you know, as part of your reflection on justice, explain what that particular encounter was, and then move to
your reflection on it.
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Anthea Vogl: We have a serious question from, Yana, who's asking…
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Anthea Vogl: Would watching the Avatar movie, the blue people one, yes, they are very blue, count as ROJ
points, since films can be?
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Anthea Vogl: Or any films with themes of social justice? Yeah, the short answer is yes, when you submit
your ROJ reflection.
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Anthea Vogl: about the particular film that you've watched, Avatar would absolutely be a social justice film.
I'm thinking about, like, when I last saw Avatar and its themes about
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Anthea Vogl: Kind of climate, and kind of dystopian futures, and managing, kind of, climate change in the
environment.
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Anthea Vogl: As long as you meet the ROJ requirements, having watched that film, or any social justice film,
that absolutely could count.
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Anthea Vogl: That was a lot of questions. Thank you all for your, engagement.
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Anthea Vogl: if there are any questions that we've missed, if anyone wants to kind of pop their hand up or
had a follow-up, I think we got through most of the questions, didn't we, Alexis? I think so. Yeah.
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Anthea Vogl: there, as you can see, even from our Q&A time, there's such a diverse kind of range of
organisations that you can get involved in, and indeed, events and activities that you can kind of watch and
then reflect on for your ROJ points.
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Anthea Vogl: Sometimes, as the questions have also demonstrated, you know, there might be…
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Anthea Vogl: Yeah, query that you have about something that you've done, and…
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Anthea Vogl: As we've mentioned a couple of times, whenever you have a question, in terms of whether or
not something is eligible.
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Anthea Vogl: always drop us a line. Sometimes students might be wanting to reach out to an organization,
but before they do that, they want to check with us that that organization is a not-for-profit or would be
eligible for their LTS hours, and we're always really happy to assist with those kinds of questions as well
before you start getting involved.
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Anthea Vogl: Any other questions?
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Anthea Vogl: Okay.
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Anthea Vogl: We're coming pretty close to time.
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Anthea Vogl: In rounding out, Alexis, was there anything you wanted to add or say before we close out our
information session?
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Alexis De Zotti: I just wanted to thank everyone, for joining and engaging so early on in the semester with
the program. It's really good that you're taking the initiative to come and learn about the Brendan program.
And I'm hoping to maybe put some faces to names,
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Alexis De Zotti: at some of the events, and maybe I'll hopefully see you guys around, I'm sure I will,
throughout the year, and the rest of my degree, probably. But yeah, and thank you, Anthea, for all your
work in organizing today's session.
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Anthea Vogl: It's my pleasure. Yeah, I have, nothing to add to Alexis' wonderful comments. We will always
have one in-person, Bread and Justice Talk every session, and that… that event is always combined with
some networking,
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Anthea Vogl: Either some drinks or some refreshments afterwards.
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Anthea Vogl: So, it's a really nice opportunity to meet us, and also to meet some of the different people in
your Brennan Justice, kind of, cohort, and get some ideas about events to attend or volunteer opportunities
that other students might be engaging with.
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Anthea Vogl: And yeah, jump on the Brennan Justice page. It gives you access to the Brennan Justice Talks.
It has different examples of organizations that you might want to get in touch with.
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Anthea Vogl: And gives you a nice sense of some student feedback around the program, and why students
get involved. But I really do, kind of, reiterate, it's a really nice way to enrich your degree. Law school
shouldn't just be about, kind of, coming to law school
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Anthea Vogl: Cramming in as much kind of high-pressure work as you can, and then going off to work. And
this is our attempt to really build a community around issues of social justice that we are all kind of
interested in and concerned about, and allow you to tailor that and meet your needs, and interests
throughout your degree.
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Anthea Vogl: So thank you all very much for joining us.
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Anthea Vogl: And please do get in touch, with questions, and if you haven't already, the… I think one of our
QR codes, gave you the link to how to register for the program, but if not, just Google the Brennan Justice
page, and the link for registration is there.
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Anthea Vogl: All right, that concludes our session. I hope everyone has a lovely afternoon, and stay in touch.
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Jana Khansa: Thank you.
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Anthea Vogl: Thanks, everyone!
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Alexis De Zotti: Thank you.